Talking to Anne Reinke from the TIA

Jim:
Thank you everyone, for joining in today. This is a great opportunity. We have the one and only Anne Reinke from the TIA, the Transportation Intermediaries Association. How are you doing, Anne?

Anne:
I’m doing just fine. Thanks so much for having me on your show. I appreciate it.

Jim:
Absolutely. We’ve done this before in the past, maybe four years ago, when you first joined the TIA. How has your journey been going so far?

Anne:
It’s hard not to evaluate my journey alongside the journey of the logistics industry because, as you recall, I got in not at the beginning of COVID but pretty early on in the pandemic. We had reached the point where people were at home, buying things, and as you know, 2021 and 2022 saw an unprecedented volume of freight moving through the country. The amount of work brokers were doing and the capacity crisis we were experiencing was unlike anything we’d seen before. If you look at any of the charts and graphs, it’s the highest volume and revenue we’ve ever had.

Then, in 2023, people started going back to their haircuts, going on trips, and they weren’t buying as much stuff for home. We saw capacity evening out; we don’t have a capacity crisis anymore. We’ve lost 4,000 brokers since 2022, and though we’re not at 2021 levels, we’re still higher than 2019 and even 2020. It’s been a whirlwind, but I think we’re in a pretty good place now, aside from the issues we’ll get into.

Jim:
Absolutely, and everything goes in cycles. I’ve been in this industry since 1991, and I’ve seen the ebbs and flows. It’s all about what you focus on—are we focusing on the tragedy of it all, or are we focusing on the growth? It’s a great thing to reflect on. The last time I saw you was at a conference. Was it in Phoenix?

Anne:
Yes, you were at the one in Phoenix, right?

Jim:
I sure was.

Anne:
That was a great one. It’s always wonderful to see members in person who we usually just talk to on the phone or via podcast. I don’t know what you thought, but everyone there seemed to be interested in fraud. The fraud sessions were jam-packed, which is unfortunate, but it’s also an indicator of how much it’s on people’s minds. Another big topic was the future of the freight market.

Jim:
Fraud has definitely increased in the industry—it seems like it’s doubled, if not more. We’ve seen new tactics not just in fraudulent claims but also in cyber sabotage, with companies having their servers taken over and held for ransom. I know TIA has had a carrier framework in place for many years, and now there’s a task force focusing on fraud and theft, which has been rampant lately. What’s behind this spike, and what is TIA doing for its members?

Anne:
There are a few hypotheses about the increase in fraud. We saw record revenues and volumes during the pandemic, which attracted the attention of professional criminal enterprises. This industry always had a low level of fraud, as does any industry, but the sheer volume of activity during the pandemic likely drew bad actors. Another issue is that we have very little enforcement—federal and state enforcement has been lacking. We’re finally seeing some movement, but it’s been slow.

This lack of enforcement makes it almost the perfect crime because it’s too easy to pull off. Another factor is that 80% of our membership has a gross annual revenue of $15 million or less, meaning they can’t always afford technology solutions to prevent fraud. Large companies have teams for vetting carriers, but smaller ones don’t have those resources. Our task force is providing education, a fraud framework, and training for those members.

We’re also gathering data on the scope of the problem so we can present it to Congress and regulators. We want them to understand this isn’t just a small problem—it’s a hundred-million-dollar issue, and something has to be done. Our volunteer membership committee is also working hard on this.

Jim:
That’s awesome. I sat on the board for over six years and participated in the policy forum, walking the halls of Congress to push for bills that help our members. The work TIA does in that area is invaluable. Speaking of which, there’s a new deputy administrator at FMCSA, Vin White. I assume TIA is having conversations with him. Can you share a bit about that?

Anne:
Yes, we sent a welcome letter to the new deputy administrator, highlighting our key issues, including the fraud issue. He’s currently on paternity leave, which is wonderful—he should take all the time he needs! We’re planning to circle back once he returns. Our VP of government affairs, Chris Burroughs, maintains regular contact with FMCSA, both with senior leadership and career staff. We’ve also invited the deputy administrator to our policy forum in September.

Jim:
Enforcement is such a critical piece of the puzzle, as is maintaining good relationships with regulators so they can support us. When you have over a billion dollars in fraud happening, it’s detrimental to the whole industry. The work you, the staff, and the board are doing is so important, and I want to acknowledge that.

Anne:
Thank you, Jim. You know this, but for many of our member companies, a fraud event can be catastrophic. They might not be able to afford the losses, and they can’t go back to their shipper and say, “We lost your freight” or “It’s being held hostage.” It can wreck relationships and even bankrupt companies. This makes it all the more critical that we address this issue, not just for brokers but for carriers and shippers, too.

One idea we’ve been discussing is hosting a broad summit with other industry stakeholders to make real policy changes. We’re also pushing legislation to hold FMCSA accountable for enforcing the laws they already have in place, but there’s so much more we can do together.

Jim:
Absolutely. Going into the policy forum, what are the key issues on the agenda?

Anne:
The policy forum is happening September 16th through the 18th. The top issues this year are fraud, the independent contractor issue—preserving the ability for drivers to remain independent if they choose—and broker transparency. Some want access to contracts between brokers and shippers, but we believe those are private agreements, and they don’t have a right to see them.

It’s a fun event—you go up to Capitol Hill with members from your state and meet with your representatives. Most meetings are with staff, but sometimes with the actual member. It’s a chance to speak directly to those who can effect change.

Jim:
The policy forum is eye-opening. You really see how bills are passed and how much of it is about communication and building relationships. It’s amazing how TIA brings people together for this, creating opportunities for us to have those critical conversations.

Anne:
Absolutely. I encourage anyone who hasn’t been to the forum to reach out to TIA and get involved. It’s a unique experience. We’ve moved it to September this year, so we’ll miss the hot D.C. summer, which is a relief!

Jim:
That’s a great decision. I remember some scorching days in D.C. Let’s talk about the carrier selection framework. TIA has been working on that for over a decade, and now with the industry fraud report, what kind of results are you seeing, and what’s next?

Anne:
The carrier framework is something we’ve had for years, providing guidelines on what to look for when selecting a carrier. It’s not a legal document but a set of best practices our members have developed. This has become even more critical with the rise in fraud, and we’ve blended the framework with our fraud prevention efforts.

There’s also a safety element to it. The FMCSA is responsible for auditing carriers, but they only audit 8% of the 500,000 independent carriers. That leaves 92% of carriers without any safety rating, which is a problem. The carrier framework helps our members make informed decisions, even when there’s limited federal oversight.

Jim:
It’d be great to see something like that tokenized in the future, perhaps using blockchain or cryptocurrency to create a ledger that can’t be manipulated. Imagine a world where carriers, brokers, and shippers are all on a transparent, secure ledger. No one could alter the information, and everything would be more reliable.

Anne:
I completely agree. I’ve met with a lot of people working on vetting and technology solutions, and I think we’ll see that kind of world sooner than we expect. There are a lot of smart people working to solve these problems, not just to make money but to truly fix the system.

Jim:
Yes, it would keep the integrity of everything intact, preventing the problems we see now. The transportation industry is tough enough without these added complications. It’s unfortunate that there are bad actors out there. I recently heard a phrase, “hurt people hurt people,” and it’s sad because it just creates an endless cycle of harm.

One thing I want to point out is that having you as the head of TIA is a real benefit for us. You have 16 years of experience at CSX as VP of government affairs, two years at the U.S. Department of Transportation, and TIA has been around for 46 years. Your leadership has been crucial for us.

Anne:
That’s so kind of you to say, Jim. I really appreciate it.

Jim:
I mean it. The TIA staff feels like family, and what you all do is amazing. You’re like a shield for us, fighting battles we don’t even know about. You did it on the Hill at CSX, and now you’re doing it for TIA’s 1,800 members, which is remarkable, especially considering the 4,000 brokers that went out of business last year.

Anne:
We are lucky to have a dedicated staff that is truly motivated to do what’s best for our members. Some of them have been with TIA for years, and they work incredibly hard. We also hold our members to high ethical standards. We’ve introduced enhanced new member requirements to ensure that our members are educated and experienced or have taken the necessary courses to become certified brokers. We want everyone to succeed, but we also want them to succeed the right way.

Jim:
When I first started out as a broker, I didn’t go to TIA, and I struggled. I kept banging my head against the wall, thinking I had to figure it all out on my own. Now, TIA provides so much guidance and support to new brokers. You even help connect members with others who can guide them through challenges, which is incredible.

Anne:
This industry, by and large, is very generous. There’s no arrogance, no holding back of information. People are willing to help. At TIA meetings, or even on our online forums, you’ll find members offering advice on everything from setting up a business to handling specific issues. Our fraud task force even has an information-sharing session where members discuss recent fraud attempts and how they handled them. It’s a community that really supports one another.

Jim:
The love in this community is unbelievable. I’ve been helped so much along my journey, and I remember calling up Jim Syfan in Georgia with some questions, and he was incredibly generous with his guidance. The same with Jerry at TransDynamic—early on, I asked about opening additional offices, and he guided me through the process. We eventually expanded to 11 offices!

It wasn’t just about copying others’ compensation models or practices. Leaders in the industry told me it wasn’t about mimicking someone else but figuring out what worked for my team, my clients, and my business. Once I realized that, it was a game changer. TIA’s frameworks, like the carrier selection framework, are just that—a framework. They guide you but allow you to make your own choices.

Anne:
That’s exactly right. Our frameworks are meant to help members create their own best practices, not dictate how they should run their businesses. It’s rewarding to see members like you taking that framework and adapting it to your needs. And you’re right about getting involved—whether it’s on a working board or in committees, it’s so important to contribute and give back.

Jim:
Absolutely. Being on the committees has allowed me to give back to the TIA community that’s supported me over the years. It’s also given me insight into how things really work, like how a bill moves through Congress. It’s a lesson in the power of communication and humanity. You see how difficult or easy things can be when you have the right conversations.

Anne:
I agree. At TIA, everything we do is driven by our members’ needs. We’re not creating educational programs because we think they’re interesting; we’re responding to what members tell us they need. The same goes for our advocacy. If we’re up on Capitol Hill talking about a priority, it’s because our members have said it’s important to them.

Jim:
That’s why it’s so important to be there and have a voice. If we don’t show up, we can’t expect Congress to understand our needs. It’s crucial to be part of that process.

Anne:
Exactly. Lobbying is a constitutionally protected right, and it’s about making sure your voice is heard. It doesn’t guarantee an outcome, but it ensures that your perspective is part of the conversation. If we’re not there, they’ll only hear from organizations that don’t represent our interests.

Jim:
Some of the relationships I’ve built, like with Tammy Duckworth, have been through TIA facilitating those connections. Being in small rooms with key decision-makers and having our voices heard is invaluable.

Anne:
Yes, you’re making them care by making them understand. That’s what makes a difference. It’s also why our PAC is such an important tool. It doesn’t guarantee outcomes, but it guarantees access. It’s another way to ensure our voices are heard.

Jim:
TIA’s PAC has been instrumental in making sure we have that audience, and it’s something I’ve never seen in other associations. You all have done a fantastic job with it.

Anne:
Thank you. It’s another lane we can use to advocate for our members. We’re very fortunate to have those resources because they allow us to have meaningful conversations with policymakers.

Jim:
Any final words you’d like to share with our audience about TIA?

Anne:
If anyone has questions for me, I’m at reinke@tia.org. You can find information about our upcoming policy forum, which runs from September 16th to 18th, at tia.org under the meetings section. We also have our Technovations conference from October 15th to 17th at TPC Sawgrass Resort in Ponte Vedra Beach.

Jim:
Anne, it’s always a pleasure. Thank you so much for joining us today. Please send my regards to your team—they’re doing incredible work.

Anne:
I will. Thank you, Jim, for everything you do for us.